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ianstone
06-22-2010, 08:24 AM
Planned mosque near NY's Ground Zero sparks debate

Karina Ioffee
NEW YORK
Mon Jun 21, 2010 4:11pm EDT

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Plans to build a mosque near the site of the September 11 attacks have touched off a firestorm among New Yorkers nearly a decade after Muslim extremists linked to al Qaeda slammed planes into the World Trade Center.
U.S. (http://www.reuters.com/news/us) | Lifestyle (http://www.reuters.com/news/lifestyle)
The Cordoba House mosque, part of a Muslim center to be built two blocks from what is now known as Ground Zero proposed as a conciliatory move, was overwhelmingly approved by a local community board in May.
But the plans are being resisted by some New Yorkers who say a mosque would be inappropriate so close to the place where nearly 3,000 people were killed.
"I'm certainly not against religious expression, but I feel it's an insensitive place to do that," said Paul Sipos, a member of the community board who did not vote on the issue. "Cordoba House should have reached out to the people who were most affected, instead of doing it by confrontation."
The center is a project of the Cordoba Initiative, a New York group aiming to improve relations between Muslims and the West. It would feature a 13-story structure with a 500-person auditorium, swimming pool, bookstores and a prayer space.
Cordoba Initiative's chairman, Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf, an Islamic scholar, said the center would be open to everyone and would help foster better understanding.
"My colleagues and I are the anti-terrorists," Rauf wrote in an editorial in New York's Daily News. "We are the people who want to embolden the vast majority of Muslims who hate terrorism to stand up to the radical rhetoric."
The proposed mosque is now awaiting approval from the New York City Landmarks Preservation Commission which expects to vote on the issue sometime this summer.
"HITTING SUCH A NERVE"
The dispute plays into a broader, unanswered questions of what should become of the World Trade Center site. Some favor a rebuilding to show the city's strength and resilience, while others believe the site should be a memorial and a place of reflection and remembrance.
"The meaning of the site is still contested," said Rosemary R. Hicks, a Columbia University scholar whose research focuses on Muslims in the United States. "What does it mean to us as Americans? Americans are so unsure, and that's why the mosque is hitting such a nerve."
Muslims too disagree over the wisdom of putting a mosque near the site of the attacks.
"After all, it was 19 Egyptian and Saudi Arabia (http://www.reuters.com/places/saudi-arabia)n thugs calling themselves Muslims who perpetrated this heinous crime on September 11th," said Hossein Kamaly, a professor of Middle Eastern culture at Barnard College, part of Columbia University.
"They want to send a message of friendship, but building a mosque where there wasn't one before, is not the most nuanced way of doing that," Kamaly said.
HIGH-PROFILE CASES, STEREOTYPES
The organizers, who hope to build more understanding among non-Muslims, say they are struggling to overcome negative public opinion fueled by high-profile cases of extremism and stereotypes among people unfamiliar with the religion.
Their cause was not helped by the case of Pakistani-born Faisal Shahzad who has been indicted on terrorism charges for trying to set off a car bomb in New York City's Times Square, center of the theater district, on a busy evening on May 1.
"When someone claims to do something in the name of Islam and you don't know much about Islam, it's much easier to go, 'Well, maybe it is because of Islam,'" said Ibrahim Hooper, a spokesman for Council on American-Islamic Relations.
"One benefit of having a mosque in an area is that when people have contact with ordinary Muslims, prejudice goes down," he said.
Plans for mosques in New York's Brooklyn and Staten Island boroughs also are hitting opposition, with neighbors worried about potential extremism.
"In the beginning, it will be peaceful, but we just don't know what they will be taught there and that bothers us," said Alex Davidson, 62, a repair man who lives near the proposed Brooklyn mosque. He said: "If you look at the statistics, most terrorists are Muslim."
Ayman Hammous, leader of a group planning to turn an unused convent into a mosque in Staten Island, said Muslims oppose such violence. "We will not give it up," he said. "We as American Muslims are against terrorists, and we don't have to be apologetic for what they do."
Ibrahim Anse, an organizer of the Brooklyn mosque, said it would provide English classes, after-school programs for children and lectures in English. Arabic prayers would be translated into English.
"We are open to the entire community, and we welcome everyone to join," Anse said.
(Reporting by Karina Ioffee; Editing by New York bureau)

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Saudi writers find voice depicting closed society (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65L0UT20100622)

DUBAI (Reuters) - Islamists in Saudi Arabia depict them as a pampered liberal elite while the authorities in this conservative Islamic state throw up obstacles in their path.
Continue Reading (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65L0UT20100622)



25 Saudi Guantanamo prisoners return to militancy (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65I22220100620)

RIYADH (Reuters) - Around 25 former detainees from Guantanamo Bay camp returned to militancy after going through a rehabilitation program for al Qaeda members in Saudi Arabia, a Saudi security official said on Saturday.
20 Jun 2010

25 Saudi Guantanamo prisoners return to militancy (http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE65I22220100619)

RIYADH (Reuters) - Around 25 former detainees from Guantanamo Bay camp returned to militancy after going through a rehabilitation program for al Qaeda members in Saudi Arabia, a Saudi security official said on Saturday.

Makes you wonder ? Some great links.

MickDonalds
06-22-2010, 08:40 AM
Oh it'll happen. New Yorkers are dumb enough and liberal enough to let it happen, that's why. What do you expect from a group of people that keep Michael Bloomberg in power?

Not much. Me neither.

If this were a Red State (For those of you that may not know what that implies: it usually means a western or southern lessly-populated state with a majority of conservative people), that mosque would get blown up, or the companies responsible for building, and the construction workers building the mosque would be harassed and trolled so hard they'd quit building it. It's effective and it works.

ianstone
06-22-2010, 08:56 AM
For my two pennies worth, I think they are pampering to the P C people.
And I also think there is money and political mileage in it too.

death2mooj
06-22-2010, 11:50 AM
Oh it'll happen. New Yorkers are dumb enough and liberal enough to let it happen, that's why. What do you expect from a group of people that keep Michael Bloomberg in power?

Not much. Me neither.

If this were a Red State (For those of you that may not know what that implies: it usually means a western or southern lessly-populated state with a majority of conservative people), that mosque would get blown up, or the companies responsible for building, and the construction workers building the mosque would be harassed and trolled so hard they'd quit building it. It's effective and it works.


Nothing but the truth there, that mosque even if ok'd would only start an unholy shitstorm for everyone involved in building it, the building inspectors, the mayor, etc....

MickDonalds
06-22-2010, 12:46 PM
Nothing but the truth there, that mosque even if ok'd would only start an unholy shitstorm for everyone involved in building it, the building inspectors, the mayor, etc....

Here in Oklahoma we've kept Abortion clinics to a minimum operating ability. Every time a new one is planned, people get on their cell phones and start calling the pro-life networks to rally people. It's hilarous when there's a ground breaking ceremony, and the next day, all the construction equipment has flat tires, shit's broken and fucked up, lol. If it does manage to get opened, people harass the workers and doctors on a HOURLY basis, which leads them to quit, and within a year the clinic closes. It's happened twice in the 3 years I've lived in Oklahoma.

If this mosque is allowed to open, the same "trolling" tactics should be employed.

Mel
06-22-2010, 04:34 PM
Come out of the cave America...It's dark in there.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxFzFIDbKpg

ianstone
06-22-2010, 06:06 PM
I have just watched the video, twice.
Come out of the cave America(and UK) its dark in there.
This is the best reply to a thread I've seen,
in all the time i have been with AC. Outstanding.
Well done Mel this is a stunning reply to an urgent problem. Thank you.

death2mooj
06-22-2010, 11:59 PM
America is scared to come out of its cave, because someone will call us racist and our fucked up lawyers would help them sue.

gremlin
06-23-2010, 07:00 AM
I have just watched the video, twice.
Come out of the cave America(and UK) its dark in there.
This is the best reply to a thread I've seen,
in all the time i have been with AC. Outstanding.
Well done Mel this is a stunning reply to an urgent problem. Thank you.

where can i find it please ?

ianstone
06-23-2010, 07:32 AM
where can i find it please ?
It just above on Mels Thread, thats the only place I know gremlin.

DefensorFortis
06-23-2010, 08:45 AM
Oh it'll happen. New Yorkers are dumb enough and liberal enough to let it happen, that's why. What do you expect from a group of people that keep Michael Bloomberg in power?

Not much. Me neither.

If this were a Red State (For those of you that may not know what that implies: it usually means a western or southern lessly-populated state with a majority of conservative people), that mosque would get blown up, or the companies responsible for building, and the construction workers building the mosque would be harassed and trolled so hard they'd quit building it. It's effective and it works.

I hope your just talking about the Down Staters. I live in Upstate Central New York. People Upstate, especially in the North Country (BTW, where the 10th Mountain Division is stationed and get loads of support from the people) are pretty conservative, as conservative as people in Red States. If someone decided to build a 13-story mosque near say the Saratoga battle grounds or another site symbolic in American history, it would get a lot of harping. As much as I hate New York State and want to move to a Red State (I'm more conservative and extreme than my dad, and he's a conservative raised in the 50's and in the early 60's before the hippies) I would rather be here Upstate than down in the city with the radical liberals.

MickDonalds
06-23-2010, 09:35 AM
I hope your just talking about the Down Staters. I live in Upstate Central New York. People Upstate, especially in the North Country (BTW, where the 10th Mountain Division is stationed and get loads of support from the people) are pretty conservative, as conservative as people in Red States. If someone decided to build a 13-story mosque near say the Saratoga battle grounds or another site symbolic in American history, it would get a lot of harping. As much as I hate New York State and want to move to a Red State (I'm more conservative and extreme than my dad, and he's a conservative raised in the 50's and in the early 60's before the hippies) I would rather be here Upstate than down in the city with the radical liberals.

Yes, you're right, DF. My apologies. I did mean "Noo Yawkers" being the city folks and people that live downstate. I've been to northern NY before and it's gorgeous. You all have to suffer because of the leftists infesting that part of your state, and it's unfortunate. Move west or south, bro. You'll love it there.

joelee
06-23-2010, 01:12 PM
Mel,that was incredible. Would you post it on the front page? A lot of the people there don't come to the forum, but need to see this.

gremlin
06-23-2010, 02:05 PM
Ian, Mel thanks for that

Mel
06-23-2010, 05:08 PM
Mel,that was incredible. Would you post it on the front page? A lot of the people there don't come to the forum, but need to see this.

Will do Joe.

joelee
06-23-2010, 06:24 PM
Thanks Mel. That also went out to all my friends and family.

DefensorFortis
06-23-2010, 07:54 PM
Yes, you're right, DF. My apologies. I did mean "Noo Yawkers" being the city folks and people that live downstate. I've been to northern NY before and it's gorgeous. You all have to suffer because of the leftists infesting that part of your state, and it's unfortunate. Move west or south, bro. You'll love it there.

Thanks for understanding bro. I just happen to plan on moving to the Lone Star State after I retire from the Army, god only knows how many years in the far future. Northern NY is gorgeous, especially in fall when the leaves change color (no, I'm not a leafer, it's not hard to miss up here) and all the fall festivals get started up.

DefensorFortis
08-20-2010, 04:54 PM
My parents and I were watching this story on the news and my dad suggested we go to Mecca and build a massive and elaborate Catholic Church :D Lol!

shatto
08-21-2010, 07:36 PM
http://www.bokbluster.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/100818boklores.jpg

http://www.creators.com/editorial_cartoons/21/16691_image.gif

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